Subject: Daniel's prophecies Since the foolishness of Nostradamus is discussed here, surel

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From: callen roy Subject: Daniel's prophecies Since the foolishness of Nostradamus is discussed here, surely the writings of a real prophet should be acceptable. This is the third in a series on the prophecies of Daniel. Specifically, the ones found in chapters 2,7 and 8. In the first section, I presented a case for parallelism among the three prophecies--that there were six divisions found in each prophecy and that they are parallel. In the second section, I started the apparent interpretation of the prophecies. Only the first three divisions were covered and were identified as three sequential kingdoms--Babylon(Neo-Babylon), Media-Persia, and Greece. Each of these were described using symbolic terminology for unique features of each kingdom. In this article I'll try to deal with the fourth section of the prophecies. It has been argued that Daniel was not written until about 180 BC, so it would not be surprising that the descriptions fit the kingdoms now identified. But, we are only half way through the prophecies, and the challenge is if kingdoms that fit the next descriptions can be found, what can be said about the authorship of Daniel? In the first three divisions, the names of the kingdoms are given. That no longer is the case for the next divisions. One point that will help to identify the next kingdoms is that the kingdoms are consecutive. Babylon was followed by Media-Persia, which was followed by Greece. The next kingdom should follow Greece. Another point, In the prophecies Media-Persia was called 'great', and Greece, which at Alexanders death was much larger than Media-Persia, was called 'very great'. The fourth kingdom is called 'exceeding great'. So, let's look at the symbolic descriptions to see if some kingdom can be identified as the fourth kingdom: The fourth kindom: Daniel 2.................Daniel 7.............Daniel 8 Iron legs................Beast /little horn...another Horn Symbolic descriptions of the fourth kingdom from each chapter. Chapter 2: 1. strong as iron--for iron breaks and smashes everything.(40) 2. as iron breaks things to pieces, so it will crush and break all others.(40) Chapter 7: 1. There before me was a fourth beast(7) 1a. I wanted to know the true meaning of the fourth beast,(19) 1b. The fourth beast is a fourth kingdom that will appear on earth.(23) 2. Terifying and frightening and very powerful. (7) 2a. and most terrifying, (19) 3. Large iron teeth (7) 3a. with its iron teeth (19) 4. it crushed and devoured it victims (7) 4a. the beast that curshed and devoured its victims (19) 5. and trampled underfoot whatever was left.(7) 5a. and trampled underfoot whatever was left.(19) 4-5b. will devour the whole earth, tramplint it down and crushing it.(23) 6. It was different from all the former beasts, (7) 6a. which was different from all the others (19) 6b. It will be different from all the other kingdoms (23) 7. it had 10 horns.(7) 7a. the ten horns on its head (20) 7b. The ten horns are ten kings who will come from this kingdom.(24) 8. there before me was another horn, (8) 9. a little one,(8) 9a. and the other horn (20) 10. Which came up among them;(8) 10a. that came up, (20) 10b. After them another king will arise,(24) 11. Three of the first horns were uprooted before it.(8) 11a. before which three of them fell (20) 11b. he will subdue three kings.(24) 12. the horn that looked more imposing than the others (20) 12a. different from the earlier ones;(24) 13. This horn had eyes like the eyes of a man (8) 13a. and had eyes (20) 14. and a mouth that spoke boastfully.(8) 14a. and a mouth that spoke boastfully.(20) 14b. I watched because of the boastful words the horn was speaking. (11) 14c. He will speak against the Most High (25) 15. As I watched this horn was waging war against the saints.(21) 15a. and defeating them.(21) 15b. and oppress his saints (25) 16. and try to change the set times (25) 17. and the laws (25) 18. The saits will be handed over to him for a time, times and half a time.(25) 19. until the beast was slain(11) 19a. his power will be taken away (26) 20. and its body destroyed and thrown into the blazing fire (11) 20a. and (the power) completely destroyed forever.(26) Chapter 8: 1. In the latter part of their reign,(23) 2. When rebels have become completely wicked,(23) 3. Out of one of them came another horn,(9) 3a. a stern-faced king will arise.(23) 3b. a master of intrigue,(23) 4. which started small(9) 5. but grew 'exceeding great'(9) KJV 5a. He will become very strong,(24) 6. but not by his own power.(24) 7. He will cause astoundng devastation(24) 8. to the South and to the East and toward the Beautiful Land.(9) 9. It grew until it reached the hosts of the heavens,(10) 10. and it threw some of the starry host down to the earth(10) 11. and trampled on them.(10) 11a. He will destroy the mighty men(24) 11b. and the holy people.(24) 12. He will cause deceit to prosper,(25) 13. and he will consider himself superior.(25) 14. When they feel secure, he will destroy many(25) 15. It set itself up to be as great as the Prince of the host(11); 15a. and take his stand against the Prince of princes.(25) 16. it took away the daily from him,(11) 17. and the place of his sanctuary was brought low.(11) 18. Because of rebellion, the host and the daily were given over to it.(12) 19. It prospered in everything it did,(12) 19a. and will succeed in whatever he does.(24) 20. and truth was thrown to the ground.(12) 21. Yet he will be destroyed,(25) 22. but not by human power.(25) 30. How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled?(13) 31. the vision concerning: a. the daily, b. the rebellion that causes desoloation, c. The surrender of the sanctuary d. and the host that will be trampled underfoot.(13) 32. It will take 2300 evening and mornings;(14) 33. then the sanctuary will be (restored, cleansed, vindicated)(14) 34. the vision of the evenings and mornings that has been given you is true(26) 35. but seal up the vision,(26) 36. for it concerns the distand future.(26) As you can see there is quite a bit of detail. Now the question is, can a real kingdom be identified that fits the description above. I'll try a quick recap, We are looking for a kingdom that follows and that was greater than Greece. It is strong as iron and conquores many lands. But it falls and is succeded by 10 nations. By the overthrow of 3 of the nations a new kingdom emerges, but is still considered or called after the original kingdom. This new kingdom is particulary offensive to God. It persecutes those loyal to God and trys to take Gods place and change His laws. It makes the meaning of the 'Sanctuary' unknown and spoiled. It will be in power for a 'time, times and half a time'(3.5 'years', 42 'months', or 1260 'days'), but it will come to an end. And, after 2300 'days' the 'Sanctuary' will be 'cleansed'. I propose that Rome is the identity of this kingdom. It followed Greece and was much greater. Roman iron clad armies swept the world, bringing Roman iron clad law. But Rome fell and the 10 'barbarian' nations swept over the lands. With the Heruli, Vandals and Ostrogoths finally overthrown in 538, the Bishop of Rome obtained the freedom to exercise the recognition given by Byzantium in 533. The Bishop of Rome has claimed to be God incarnate, the vicor of Christ, on earth. The Bishop of Rome has tried to change the laws of God, and the Bishop of Rome martyred millions who disagreed with the 'Christian Church' of Rome. Salvation from sin and death by substitution as portrayed in the symbolism of the 'Sanctuary', was supplanted with apeals and appeasments to an 'angry God'. But, in 1798, 1260 years after the begining in 538, General Berthier ended the unequaled and nearly unchallenged but declining rule of the Bishop of Rome. Admitedly, this is a quick sweep of a section of history, and other details of the prophecies could be further discussed, but the identity of this 'kingdom' as Rome--both Pagan and Papal--is sure to stand. There is no way that this could just be lucky guessing on Daniel's part. And there is no way that the Book could have been altered to fit the circumstances, because the latest that anyone can propose for a supposed edited edition of Daniel is about 180 BC!--some 100 years before Rome became the ruling power in the Mediterainian. So, How did Daniel get this information? How come history has been following these prophecies from Babylon, to Media Persia, and Greece, Rome? and---we're not done yet! There is the kingdom of the iron and clay feet and the final 'kingdom' of God to be yet discussed. (to be continued in a later post) C. Allen Roy


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