By: Chris Ferree To: Fredric Rice Re: VULGARITY AND HATRED? UP Discussing the controversia

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By: Chris Ferree To: Fredric Rice Re: VULGARITY AND HATRED? UP Discussing the controversial "VULGARITY AND HATRED?", Fredric Rice said... FR>The physics and genetics and geology and -- well, everything -- simply doe FR>allow the myth to happen. Worse, the whole bit of mythology was taken fro FR>Gilgamesh Epic -- a set of mythologies which predate the Christian mytholo FR>Many cultures that live near water have the same type of myth -- some even FR>the boat or raft filled with animals and a single family to escape the wat FR>In what was once the United States <-heh-> the Navahos had a Trickster rat FR>than the Christian 'Satan' or the Greek Pan which 'Satan' was taken from. FR>Trickster was Coyotee Brother and he stole River Mother's child as a prank FR>River Mother, being someone annoyed, tried to drown Coyotee Brother. Firs FR>and First Woman were forced to leave their "second planet" on a boat conta FR>two each of every animal and themselves; a boat with a single door, FR>interestingly enough. FR>Rather than coming to rest on the high place which other cultures concoct, FR>Navaho myths have the boat coming to the third planet -- Earth. I'm not FR>certain yet I think they also have a myth which predicts their having to g FR>through it yet again for a fourth and final journey to another world. [stuff deleted for brevity] Well, here's Ovid's flood story (the Metamorphoses of Ovid, a new verse translation by Allen Mandelbaum) Book 1, Latin [330-371] The fury of the sea subsided, too. And Neptune set aside his three pronged weapon; the god of waters pacified the waves and summoned sea-gareen Triton, bidding him to blow on his resounding conch- a sign for seas and streams to end the flood, retreat. And Triton, as he rose up from the deep- his shoulders shell-encrysted- held his conch: a twisting hollow form that, starting from a point, then spiraled up to a wide whorl- the conch that, when it's sounded in midsea, reechoes on the shores to west and east. Now, too, when Triton drew it to his lips- wet with sea brine that dripped from his soaked beard- and, just as Neptune ordered, blew retreat, the sound reached all the waters of the sea and those that flow on land- and having heard his call, they all obeyed: they curbed their course. The rivers fall back, and the hills emerge; the sea has shores once more; the riverbeds, however full their flow, now keep it channeled; the land increases as the waters ebb; the soil can now be seen; and then, at last, after that long night, trees show their bare tops with traces of the flood-slime on their boughs. The world had been restored to what it was. But when Deucalion saw earth so forlorn, a wasteland where deep silence rules, a bare and desolate expanse, he shed sad tears and said to Pyrrha: (BTW, Deucalion was "a man with deep.. love for justice" and his wife Pyrrha was "none matched .. in devotion to the gods.") "O my wife, dear sister, the only woman left on earth, the one to whom I first was linked as a dear cousin and then as husband, now we are together in danger: all the lands both east and west are empy now- and we alone are left: the sea has taken all the rest. And we may not survive: we have no certainties- that vision of the clouds still haunts my mind. How would you feel, sad heart, if you'd survived the fatal flood, but I had lost my life? How would you, all alone, have borne the fear? With whom would you-alone-have shared your tears? For if the sea had swallowed you, dear wife, I, too-believe me-would have followed you and let the deluge drwon me, too. Would I were master of the arts my father plied; then I, son of Prometheus, would mold and so renew mankind-its many tribes. But now the race of men has been reduced- so did the gods decree-to me and you: We are the last exemplars." Ovid lived from 43 BC to AD 17, but these myths had roots from long ago. Chris Ferree ... Deep roots are not reached by the frost. TLX v3.40 --- WM v3.10/93-1181 * Origin: Arc Light BBS/8 lines/30 cds Indpls IN 317/575-8833 (1:231/285.0) SEEN-BY: 102/2 138 752 835 850 851 890 943 1302 112/1 147/7 170/400 206/1701 SEEN-BY: 209/207 209 710 720 770 270/101 290/627 309/2 345/31 396/1 640/75 SEEN-BY: 3615/50 @PATH: 231/285 3615/50 396/1 209/209 102/2 851


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