#apologetics: DEBATE LOGS - 5/13/96
#apologetics: DEBATE LOGS - 5/13/96
[17:58] ProfG (firstname.lastname@example.org) joined #apologetics.
[18:22] Melkor (Morgoth@Cb.globalx.net) joined #apologetics.
[18:22] if a tree falls in the woods and no
one is around to hear it does it make a noise?
[18:23] hiya Mel
[18:23] how r u today prof?
[18:23] better :-)
[18:23] compared to what?
[18:23] can type again :-)
[18:23] had an accident
[18:23] that could be handy
[18:23] what happened?
[18:23] riding my bicycle, got hit by a car
[18:24] that just might hurt
[18:24] that's Miami fer ya
[18:24] dislocated shoulder
[18:24] so...if a tree falls in the woods and
no one is around to hear it does it make a noise?
[18:24] of course
[18:24] nope it doesn't
[18:24] noise is not dependent upon the hearer
[18:25] if no one was around to hear it then
it didn't make a noise
[18:25] of course it depends on what u think
[18:25] noise is sound waves travelling through
the air. that doesn't change just because there is
[18:26] i am well aware of the scientific definition
[18:26] that's nice.
[18:26] ya it is:)
[18:26] is svenson my best buddy now? :-)
[18:26] i think that question has more to do
with whether there is reality outside of mans mind
[18:26] oh ya he loves u
[18:27] I don't think that question has much
to do with that at all.
[18:27] well i do...in a sense
[18:27] what sense is that?
[18:28] without mankind there is nothing
[18:28] prove it
[18:28] reality doesn't exist
[18:28] it can't be proven
[18:28] just a thought
[18:28] then why should I believe it?
[18:28] i had this morning
[18:28] i'm not telling u 2
[18:28] just giving u something to think about
[18:29] well, that certainly is interesting.
[18:29] Topic changed by ApoloBotemail@example.com:
The Home of Rational Theism
[18:29] Apolo's timer went off :-)
[18:29] ok...thought there was a ghost in here
[18:29] SynnerJim (SynnerJim@www-38-236.gnn.com) joined
[18:29] hello Jim :-)
[18:29] Well, well
[18:30] and well
[18:30] Don't give me no smiley faces
[18:30] tensions rise
[18:31] W (firstname.lastname@example.org) got netsplit.
[18:31] So you apologize for xianity here?...must
be a full time job
[18:31] whoa netsplit
[18:31] Nick change: Melkor -> Meaglin
[18:31] And "rational theism"? ...an oxymoron
if there ever was one
[18:32] Does that involve the traditional
xian means of defence?...like burnings at the stake,
crematoria & mass graves?
[18:32] there r none that doeth good?
[18:33] whoever wrote that is a fool
[18:33] I actually own a couple bibles...they're
not as fun as the other mythologies I own
[18:33] Jim: no, those aren't "Christian" means
of defense, for they are not Biblical apologetics
[18:34] A xian is a xian is a xian
[18:34] Jim: tell me what you think of the Bibles
[18:34] Meaglin: no, not one
[18:34] profg....my mother does good
[18:34] Not much... I see a basically bigoted
world view reflected in them
[18:35] so i guess that is wrong
[18:35] Jim: do you not have a "bigoted world
[18:35] Not really....
[18:35] W (email@example.com) returned to #apologetics.
[18:35] Jim: I'll bet you do.
[18:35] if man does not exist...nothing exists
[18:35] I wouldn't declare those who disagree
with me "Satanic", like xians do
[18:35] Meaglin: prove your assertion.
[18:36] Mode change '+o W ' by okc.ok.us.undernet.org
[18:36] Jim: no, but you declare them "wrong"
[18:36] like i said profg...just something
to think about
[18:36] Prof...have you read Elaine Pagels
latest book, "The Origin of Satan"?
[18:36] think about in what way, Meaglin?
[18:36] profg..that verse in not correct...my
mother is a good person
[18:36] any way u want
[18:36] no, Jim, I haven't read that particular
[18:36] Yeah, but Prof....I don't burn people
at the stake
[18:37] Meaglin: how do you know your mother
is a good person?
[18:37] Jim: neither do I. :-)
[18:37] because i see her do "good" things
[18:37] Meaglin: how do you know those things
[18:37] You're a xian Prof...sure you do
[18:37] she cares about other people
[18:37] Jim: prove I do.
[18:37] Meaglin: how do you know that that is
a good thing?
[18:37] profg...good is what u think it is
[18:37] Isn't that the REAL threat behind
the "fires of hell"?
[18:38] Meaglin: so if "good is what u think it
is" then how can I be wrong if I say your mother is
[18:38] Jim: what?
[18:38] W (firstname.lastname@example.org) got netsplit.
[18:38] The xian church burned witches, Cathars,
Templars & Jews at the stake
[18:38] W (email@example.com) returned to #apologetics.
[18:38] Mode change '+o W ' by channels2.undernet.org
[18:38] profg....because i disagree
[18:39] Jim: sinful men in the Roman Catholic
church did that.
[18:39] Ergo, it is a typical way for xians
to deal with those who disagree with them
[18:39] i don't doubt for a minute u think
my mother is not good
[18:39] Meaglin: prove you are right and I am
[18:39] i can prove nothing....it is irrelevant
[18:39] Well, the English church did their
share...as did the Presbyterians in Scotland
[18:40] what is irrelevant?
[18:40] proving it
[18:40] i think it is so it doesn't matter
[18:40] Jim: if a person calls himself a logician
and commits nothing but logical fallacies and says
they are not illogical, is that person truly a logician?
[18:41] Meaglin: a difficult way to live one's
[18:41] not really
[18:41] But all xians are believers in those
[18:41] "I think the light is green so it doesn't
[18:41] but the light is red
[18:41] profg..not in the least
[18:41] They found justification in
[18:41] red is white and white is black
[18:41] But...there is no light
[18:42] Jim: prove that all people who call themselves
Christians are believers in the whole Bible.
[18:42] A traffic light is real
[18:42] Jim: you made a universal statement,
now please prove it.
[18:42] Meaglin: uhhhh... make some sense please?
[18:42] prof..prove my statement wrong
[18:42] nope is right
[18:42] you can't prove it, Jim
[18:42] You xians start pogroms at the drop
of a hat...you're tryin to start one now
[18:43] "You atheists massacre millions at the
drop of a hat ... you're trying to do so now"
[18:43] synner...who cares about xianity and
petty bickering...i need my color wheel finished for
[18:43] red is white and white is black
[18:44] prof..prove my statement wrong
[18:44] Sure I can...all those folks I mentioned
used your bibles for their own ends...ergo those who
use those bibles must at least accept those methods
[18:44] Jim: the actions of a few who claim to
follow a belief system do not prove whether a particular
belief system is right or wrong.
[18:44] synner arguing whether god exists is
[18:44] Meaglin: the proof is in the definition
[18:44] Tell that to the Albigenes, Prof
[18:45] what definition?
[18:45] Meaglin: red is not white because red
is not defined as white.
[18:45] prove it isn't
[18:45] Ther is no argument Meaglin...there
are no gods...only believers in them
[18:45] the proof is in the definition.
[18:46] prove the definition is correct
[18:46] "there are no atheists...only people who
claim to be atheists"
[18:46] synner it doesn't matter if there is
a god or not
[18:46] What color of red
[18:46] Optical colors or pigments?
[18:46] Meaglin: because for red to be white
would be a logical fallacy. Unless you are willing
to discard logic and be illogical and irrational.
[18:47] which wouldn't surprise me about now.
[18:47] how is it a logical fallacy?
[18:47] Sure it does Meaglin..at its root
it is basically a political issue
[18:47] Topic changed by ApoloBotfirstname.lastname@example.org:
There are no atheists...only people who claim to be
[18:48] It's not Meaglin..ProfG's root cause
(god) is the logical fallacy
[18:48] damn...gotta go...i'll be back though...prof..there
is no logical way of thinking
[18:48] Meaglin: "My car is in the driveway, and
my car is not in the driveway." logical fallacy. "red
is red, and red is not red." logical fallacy.
[18:48] profg..your car is everywhere at once..prove
[18:48] Jim: you aren't an atheist.
[18:48] Meaglin (Morgoth@Cb.globalx.net) left irc:
[18:49] Bye xians..hope people treat you
the way you've treated them!
[18:49] SynnerJim (SynnerJim@www-38-236.gnn.com) left
[19:10] ProfG (email@example.com) left #apologetics.Original
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