Computer underground Digest Sun Apr 18 1993 Volume 5 : Issue 28 ISSN 1004-042X Editors: Ji

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Computer underground Digest Sun Apr 18 1993 Volume 5 : Issue 28 ISSN 1004-042X Editors: Jim Thomas and Gordon Meyer (TK0JUT2@NIU.BITNET) Archivist: Brendan Kehoe Shadow-Archivists: Dan Carosone / Paul Southworth Ralph Sims / Jyrki Kuoppala Ian Dickinson Cyop Editor: Etaoin Shrdlu, Senior CONTENTS, #5.28 (Apr 18 1993) File 1--NREN Wrap (or "Joe's Ride at the Houston Chron") File 2--Clinton Proposes National ID Card File 3--White House Crypto Statement File 4--Debate on Gov't Encryption Initiative (from CPSR) File 5--RU Sirius/Mondo interview (from GEnie) File 6--Rune Stone BBS (IIRG Home Board) Back On-Line Cu-Digest is a weekly electronic journal/newsletter. Subscriptions are available at no cost electronically from The editors may be contacted by voice (815-753-6430), fax (815-753-6302) or U.S. mail at: Jim Thomas, Department of Sociology, NIU, DeKalb, IL 60115. Issues of CuD can also be found in the Usenet news group; on CompuServe in DL0 and DL4 of the IBMBBS SIG, DL1 of LAWSIG, and DL0 and DL12 of TELECOM; on GEnie in the PF*NPC RT libraries and in the VIRUS/SECURITY library; from America Online in the PC Telecom forum under "computing newsletters;" On Delphi in the General Discussion database of the Internet SIG; on the PC-EXEC BBS at (414) 789-4210; and on: Rune Stone BBS (IIRG WHQ) 203-832-8441 NUP:Conspiracy CuD is also available via Fidonet File Request from 1:11/70; unlisted nodes and points welcome. EUROPE: from the ComNet in Luxembourg BBS (++352) 466893; ANONYMOUS FTP SITES: UNITED STATES: ( in /pub/cud ( in /pub/CuD/cud in /pub/mirror/cud AUSTRALIA: ( in /pub/text/CuD. EUROPE: in pub/doc/cud. (Finland) in pub/cud (United Kingdom) Back issues also may be obtained through mailservers at: or COMPUTER UNDERGROUND DIGEST is an open forum dedicated to sharing information among computerists and to the presentation and debate of diverse views. CuD material may be reprinted for non-profit as long as the source is cited. Some authors do copyright their material, and they should be contacted for reprint permission. It is assumed that non-personal mail to the moderators may be reprinted unless otherwise specified. Readers are encouraged to submit reasoned articles relating to computer culture and communication. Articles are preferred to short responses. Please avoid quoting previous posts unless absolutely necessary. DISCLAIMER: The views represented herein do not necessarily represent the views of the moderators. Digest contributors assume all responsibility for ensuring that articles submitted do not violate copyright protections. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1993 00:56:26 EDT From: Joe Abernathy Subject: File 1--NREN Wrap (or "Joe's Ride at the Houston Chron") ((MODERATORS' NOTE: The following is Joe Abernathy's last story for the Houston Chronicle. We've known Joe since 1990, and have found him a strong supporter of civil liberties in cyberspace. As his knowledge of the the topic has grown, so has the sophistication of his articles. His periodic columns in The Village Voice's "Wired" section have been consistently penetrating commentaries on law, ethics, and policy. We wish Joe the best in his new life. Thanks Joe.)) NREN Wrap -- This is my last story for the Houston Chronicle. It is to appear on April 4, 1993. Please feel free to redistribute it for any non-commercial use. To those of you who have provided so much help these past four years, thanks. It's been a real education. I've accepted the job of Senior Editor-News at PC World magazine, and I'll still be writing the Village Voice Technocracy column, so I hope you'll all stay in touch. My new contact information is P.O. Box 572390, Houston, Texas 77257-2390, By JOE ABERNATHY Houston Chronicle Staff Writer The specters of class struggle and international economic warfare are casting a shadow over administration hearings on how to build a sophisticated national computer network. Billed as an engine of job growth, a central concern is emerging that the "data superhigh way" promised by Vice President Al Gore and President Bill Clinton during the campaign could produce a large underclass of "information have-nots." Based on an emerging global computer net work known as the Internet, which links up to 12 million people in more than 30 nations, the National Research and Education Network (NREN) is a decade-long project of former Sen. Gore. Gore envisions a future in which oceans of data, including libraries of movies, books and other creative works, would be readily avail able to every home. In selling a $5 billion spending plan focused on the network in 1992, Gore held forth the image of classrooms without walls, sophisticated medical collaborations, and globally competitive small businesses. "The NREN is at all odds the most important and lucrative marketplace of the 21st century," he said in a recent statement. But in trying to make it work, it has become apparent that the NREN remains in many ways a captive of its privileged institutional heritage. Some Americans don't even have telephone service, and many still don't have computers with which to access the net. Two congressional hearings were held in late March concerning the National Information Infrastructure, and a bill has been introduced that would take up where Gore's 1992 High-Performance Computing Act left off _ bringing the net to classrooms, small business and other potentially disenfranchised Americans. Clinton's budget includes an additional $489 million over six years for the network. And while the regional Bells, newspapers and other information giants have been struggling for years over the future of the medium, congressional insiders say that with the in creased attention, a resolution seems likely to be found during the current session of Congress. "What I think is really getting squeezed out is that there hasn't been a genuine, public interest, bottom-up grass roots voice. It's a huge, huge issue," said Marc Rotenberg, director of the Washington offices of Computer Professionals for Social Responsibility, the primary champion of civil rights in the new electronic medium. "It's about people, it's about institutions, it's about who gets to connect and on what terms." Observers also fear that the rush to wield the network as an economic weapon could produce dramatic incursions into free speech and other civil liberties. "I'm very concerned that the rhetoric about national competitiveness is transforming itself into a new cold war," said Gary Chapman, director of CPSR's 21st Century Project in Cambridge, Mass. "The concerns of intelligence and other federal agencies including NASA has been to look at technology resources that are not related to military security but to economic benefits as being things that have to be protected by Draconian measures of security." Recent disciplinary actions at NASA Ames Research Center in Northern California seem to support Chapman's concerns. Up to eight of the 11 scientists disciplined in December were targeted because of their participation in politically oriented, international discussion groups hosted on the Internet computer network, according to documents obtained by the Houston Chronicle under the Freedom of Information Act, along with subsequent interviews of NASA Ames personnel. "Some people there were accused of dealing with foreign nationals about non-classified technology issues," said Chapman, whose organization also has made inquiries into the matter. "NASA said the U.S. has to protect its technology assets because of the global environment of competitiveness." The issues are even simpler for Raymond Luh, a subcontracting engineer fired by NASA. Luh, an American of Chinese ancestry, feels that his career was destroyed simply because he joined in one of the thousands of political discussions aired each day over the Internet. "I feel I have been gravely wronged by NASA," Luh said. "I cannot possibly seek employment elsewhere. My reputation as a law-abiding citizen and a hard-working researcher has been tarnished almost beyond repair." NASA refused to comment on the matter. According to FOIA documents provided by NASA's Office of the Inspector General, Luh was fired when "a document containing Chinese writing was found in (Luh's computer). ... Investigation determined that Luh's office computer held a large volume of files relating to his efforts to promote Most Favored Nation trade status for the People's Republic of China. ... Luh was not authorized to use his computer for this activity." To Luh, however, he was only one of the chorus of voices that joined in a fiery debate surrounding fallout from the Tiananmen Square massacre. He wasn't trying to make policy _ he was exercising intellectual freedom, in his spare time. "That's a very dangerous and disturbing kind of trend," said Chapman. "The parallel is with the Cold War and transforming the modes of thinking and the practices of these agencies into new forms of control, even in the absence of militarily significant enemies. We'll start thinking about the Japanese or whatever Pacific Rim country you want to pick as being `enemies,' and intellectual commerce with these people will be a matter of economic security. "The freedom of expression aspect of that is very critical. We want to make sure that this is a system in which people can express themselves freely without repercussions." Observers fear that Luh may be only the first such casualty as federal agencies and special interest groups reshape the Internet into their own model, carving up a pie estimated to be worth $3.5 trillion. While Gore's vision implies the construction of a high-speed, high-tech fiber optic network, a number of counter-proposals are being floated. The Electronic Frontier Foundation _ which earlier made a name for itself with a successful court challenge to the conduct of the Secret Service in a hacker crackdown _ is focusing on building a less powerful, less costly network that could reach more people, more quickly. "Our central concern is that we get from debate to doing something," said Jerry Berman, EFF director. EFF's approach _ endorsed by Rep. Edward J. Markey, D-Mass. _ is to build an ISDN (Integrated Services Digital Network) service atop the telephone network, making a modest level of digital computer transmission available quickly to every home. The more sophisticated fiber optic approach implied by Gore's NREN could be implemented as time and money allow. But few voices have been heard backing ISDN. "The current state of the discussion is turmoil and chaos," said the CPSR's Rotenberg. "It's a mistake to place too much emphasis on any technological configuration. A lot of that energy and those resources would be better spent talking about users and institutions rather than technology and standards. "This is like trying to explain railroads in the 18th century or cars in the 19th century. Here we are in the 20th century, and we know something big is happening right under our feet and we know it has something to do with these new telecommunications technologies. "None of us knows where this is going to take us, but I think people should have some sensitivity to the prospect that the future world we're going to live in is going to be shaped in many ways by the decisions we make today about the information infrastructure." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Apr 93 16:33:01 EDT From: "W. K. (Bill) Gorman" <34AEJ7D@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> Subject: File 2--Clinton Proposes National ID Card Here is a data pointer you might find of interest. ++++++++++++++++++++++++ATTACHMENT++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Subject--A national ID card - coming soon from the Clinton administration? Date--7 Apr 93 18:52:13 GMT This is a brief synopsis of an article in Section B, page 7, in the Wednesday, April 7, 1993 San Jose Mercury News. Excerpted without permission. All typos are mine. Headline: Big Brother's little sibling: the smart card Author: Martin Anderson The article discusses work ongoing in the Clinton administration to give everyone a "smart card" for personal medical information, to cut down on waste, fraud, and abuse in health care. "But now the smart card idea may have taken an ugly turn. Recently, Ira Magaziner, a Uria Heepish bureaucrat in charge of coordinating the development of health care policy for the Clinton Administration, asserted they want "to create an integrated system with a card that everyone will get at birth." another paragraph: "The smart card is an open, engraved invitation to a national identity card. In the early 1980s when I worked in the West Wing of the White House as President Reagan's domestic policy adviser I was surprised by the ardent desire of government bureaucrats, many of them Reagan appointees, for a national identity card." Apparently it almost happened. "The idea of a national identity card, with a new name, has risen once again from the graveyard of bad policy ideas, more powerful and virulent than ever. Unless it is stopped quickly we may live to see the end of privacy in the United States, all of us tagged like so many fish." The best part of this article is that it gives phone numbers to call to express your opinion, as Clinton has invited the public to do. I urge everyone to call, and to spread the word. (202) 456 - 1414 White House switch board (202) 456 - 6406 Ira Magaziner's direct line (the person working for Clinton on the smart card) about the author: "Martin Anderson, a senior adviser on the President's Economic Policy Advisory Board during the Reagan administration, is now a senior fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford. He wrote this article fore the Scripps Howard News Service." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 16:20:19 EST From: David Sobel Subject: File 3--White House Crypto Statement White House Crypto Statement THE WHITE HOUSE Office of the Press Secretary For Immediate Release April 16, 1993 STATEMENT BY THE PRESS SECRETARY The President today announced a new initiative that will bring the Federal Government together with industry in a voluntary program to improve the security and privacy of telephone communications while meeting the legitimate needs of law enforcement. The initiative will involve the creation of new products to accelerate the development and use of advanced and secure telecommunications networks and wireless communications links. For too long there has been little or no dialogue between our private sector and the law enforcement community to resolve the tension between economic vitality and the real challenges of protecting Americans. Rather than use technology to accommodate the sometimes competing interests of economic growth, privacy and law enforcement, previous policies have pitted government against industry and the rights of privacy against law enforcement. Sophisticated encryption technology has been used for years to protect electronic funds transfer. It is now being used to protect electronic mail and computer files. While encryption technology can help Americans protect business secrets and the unauthorized release of personal information, it also can be used by terrorists, drug dealers, and other criminals. A state-of-the-art microcircuit called the "Clipper Chip" has been developed by government engineers. The chip represents a new approach to encryption technology. It can be used in new, relatively inexpensive encryption devices that can be attached to an ordinary telephone. It scrambles telephone communications using an encryption algorithm that is more powerful than many in commercial use today. This new technology will help companies protect proprietary information, protect the privacy of personal phone conversations and prevent unauthorized release of data transmitted electronically. At the same time this technology preserves the ability of federal, state and local law enforcement agencies to intercept lawfully the phone conversations of criminals. A "key-escrow" system will be established to ensure that the "Clipper Chip" is used to protect the privacy of law-abiding Americans. Each device containing the chip will have two unique 2 "keys," numbers that will be needed by authorized government agencies to decode messages encoded by the device. When the device is manufactured, the two keys will be deposited separately in two "key-escrow" data bases that will be established by the Attorney General. Access to these keys will be limited to government officials with legal authorization to conduct a wiretap. The "Clipper Chip" technology provides law enforcement with no new authorities to access the content of the private conversations of Americans. To demonstrate the effectiveness of this new technology, the Attorney General will soon purchase several thousand of the new devices. In addition, respected experts from outside the government will be offered access to the confidential details of the algorithm to assess its capabilities and publicly report their findings. The chip is an important step in addressing the problem of encryption's dual-edge sword: encryption helps to protect the privacy of individuals and industry, but it also can shield criminals and terrorists. We need the "Clipper Chip" and other approaches that can both provide law-abiding citizens with access to the encryption they need and prevent criminals from using it to hide their illegal activities. In order to assess technology trends and explore new approaches (like the key-escrow system), the President has directed government agencies to develop a comprehensive policy on encryption that accommodates: -- the privacy of our citizens, including the need to employ voice or data encryption for business purposes; -- the ability of authorized officials to access telephone calls and data, under proper court or other legal order, when necessary to protect our citizens; -- the effective and timely use of the most modern technology to build the National Information Infrastructure needed to promote economic growth and the competitiveness of American industry in the global marketplace; and -- the need of U.S. companies to manufacture and export high technology products. The President has directed early and frequent consultations with affected industries, the Congress and groups that advocate the privacy rights of individuals as policy options are developed. 3 The Administration is committed to working with the private sector to spur the development of a National Information Infrastructure which will use new telecommunications and computer technologies to give Americans unprecedented access to information. This infrastructure of high-speed networks ("information superhighways") will transmit video, images, HDTV programming, and huge data files as easily as today's telephone system transmits voice. Since encryption technology will play an increasingly important role in that infrastructure, the Federal Government must act quickly to develop consistent, comprehensive policies regarding its use. The Administration is committed to policies that protect all Americans' right to privacy while also protecting them from those who break the law. Further information is provided in an accompanying fact sheet. The provisions of the President's directive to acquire the new encryption technology are also available. For additional details, call Mat Heyman, National Institute of Standards and Technology, (301) 975-2758. - - --------------------------------- QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS ABOUT THE CLINTON ADMINISTRATION'S TELECOMMUNICATIONS INITIATIVE Q: Does this approach expand the authority of government agencies to listen in on phone conversations? A: No. "Clipper Chip" technology provides law enforcement with no new authorities to access the content of the private conversations of Americans. Q: Suppose a law enforcement agency is conducting a wiretap on a drug smuggling ring and intercepts a conversation encrypted using the device. What would they have to do to decipher the message? A: They would have to obtain legal authorization, normally a court order, to do the wiretap in the first place. They would then present documentation of this authorization to the two entities responsible for safeguarding the keys and obtain the keys for the device being used by the drug smugglers. The key is split into two parts, which are stored separately in order to ensure the security of the key escrow system. Q: Who will run the key-escrow data banks? A: The two key-escrow data banks will be run by two independent entities. At this point, the Department of Justice and the Administration have yet to determine which agencies will oversee the key-escrow data banks. Q: How strong is the security in the device? How can I be sure how strong the security is? A: This system is more secure than many other voice encryption systems readily available today. While the algorithm will remain classified to protect the security of the key escrow system, we are willing to invite an independent panel of cryptography experts to evaluate the algorithm to assure all potential users that there are no unrecognized vulnerabilities. Q: Whose decision was it to propose this product? A: The National Security Council, the Justice Department, the Commerce Department, and other key agencies were involved in this decision. This approach has been endorsed by the President, the Vice President, and appropriate Cabinet officials. Q: Who was consulted? The Congress? Industry? A: We have on-going discussions with Congress and industry on encryption issues, and expect those discussions to intensify as we carry out our review of encryption policy. We have briefed members of Congress and industry leaders on the decisions related to this initiative. Q: Will the government provide the hardware to manufacturers? A: The government designed and developed the key access encryption microcircuits, but it is not providing the microcircuits to product manufacturers. Product manufacturers can acquire the microcircuits from the chip manufacturer that produces them. Q: Who provides the "Clipper Chip"? A: Mykotronx programs it at their facility in Torrance, California, and will sell the chip to encryption device manufacturers. The programming function could be licensed to other vendors in the future. Q: How do I buy one of these encryption devices? A: We expect several manufacturers to consider incorporating the "Clipper Chip" into their devices. Q: If the Administration were unable to find a technological solution like the one proposed, would the Administration be willing to use legal remedies to restrict access to more powerful encryption devices? A: This is a fundamental policy question which will be considered during the broad policy review. The key escrow mechanism will provide Americans with an encryption product that is more secure, more convenient, and less expensive than others readily available today, but it is just one piece of what must be the comprehensive approach to encryption technology, which the Administration is developing. The Administration is not saying, "since encryption threatens the public safety and effective law enforcement, we will prohibit it outright" (as some countries have effectively done); nor is the U.S. saying that "every American, as a matter of right, is entitled to an unbreakable commercial encryption product." There is a false "tension" created in the assessment that this issue is an "either-or" proposition. Rather, both concerns can be, and in fact are, harmoniously balanced through a reasoned, balanced approach such as is proposed with the "Clipper Chip" and similar encryption techniques. Q: What does this decision indicate about how the Clinton Administration's policy toward encryption will differ from that of the Bush Administration? A: It indicates that we understand the importance of encryption technology in telecommunications and computing and are committed to working with industry and public-interest groups to find innovative ways to protect Americans' privacy, help businesses to compete, and ensure that law enforcement agencies have the tools they need to fight crime and terrorism. Q: Will the devices be exportable? Will other devices that use the government hardware? A: Voice encryption devices are subject to export control requirements. Case-by-case review for each export is required to ensure appropriate use of these devices. The same is true for other encryption devices. One of the attractions of this technology is the protection it can give to U.S. companies operating at home and abroad. With this in mind, we expect export licenses will be granted on a case-by-case basis for U.S. companies seeking to use these devices to secure their own communications abroad. We plan to review the possibility of permitting wider exportability of these products. --------------end------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 16:43:02 EST From: Dave Banisar Subject: File 4--Debate on Gov't Encryption Initiative (from CPSR) April 16, 1993 Washington, DC COMPUTER PROFESSIONALS CALL FOR PUBLIC DEBATE ON NEW GOVERNMENT ENCRYPTION INITIATIVE Computer Professionals for Social Responsibility (CPSR) today called for the public disclosure of technical data underlying the government's newly-announced "Public Encryption Management" initiative. The new cryptography scheme was announced today by the White House and the National Institute for Standards and Technology (NIST), which will implement the technical specifications of the plan. A NIST spokesman acknowledged that the National Security Agency (NSA), the super- secret military intelligence agency, had actually developed the encryption technology around which the new initiative is built. According to NIST, the technical specifications and the Presidential directive establishing the plan are classified. To open the initiative to public review and debate, CPSR today filed a series of Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests with key agencies, including NSA, NIST, the National Security Council and the FBI for information relating to the encryption plan. The CPSR requests are in keeping with the spirit of the Computer Security Act, which Congress passed in 1987 in order to open the development of non-military computer security standards to public scrutiny and to limit NSA's role in the creation of such standards. CPSR previously has questioned the role of NSA in developing the so-called "digital signature standard" (DSS), a communications authentication technology that NIST proposed for government-wide use in 1991. After CPSR sued NIST in a FOIA lawsuit last year, the civilian agency disclosed for the first time that NSA had, in fact, developed that security standard. NSA is due to file papers in federal court next week justifying the classification of records concerning its creation of the DSS. David Sobel, CPSR Legal Counsel, called the administration's apparent commitment to the privacy of electronic communications, as reflected in today's official statement, "a step in the right direction." But he questioned the propriety of NSA's role in the process and the apparent secrecy that has thus far shielded the development process from public scrutiny. "At a time when we are moving towards the development of a new information infrastructure, it is vital that standards designed to protect personal privacy be established openly and with full public participation. It is not appropriate for NSA -- an agency with a long tradition of secrecy and opposition to effective civilian cryptography -- to play a leading role in the development process." CPSR is a national public-interest alliance of computer industry professionals dedicated to examining the impact of technology on society. CPSR has 21 chapters in the U.S. and maintains offices in Palo Alto, California, Cambridge, Massachusetts and Washington, DC. For additional information on CPSR, call (415) 322-3778 or e-mail . ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 93 22:00:39 EDT From: Gordon Meyer <72307.1502@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: File 5--RU Sirius/Mondo interview (from GEnie) The following is an edited transcript of a GEnie real-time conference held with R.U. Sirius of Mondo 2000. The full transcript is available for downloading on GEnie. Reprinted with permission. Copyright (C), 1993 Jack Smith, the Writers' RoundTable All rights reserved. No part of this file may be reproduced or copied by any means (graphic, electronic, magical or mechanical) without the written permission of Jack Smith (GEnie address = WRITERS.INK, snail mail = 401 North Washington Street, Rockville, MD, 20850, MN3). This file was downloaded from the Writers' RoundTable on GEnie. To join GEnie you can signup via computer or by following these steps: 1) Set your communications software for half duplex (local echo) at 300, 1200 or 2400 baud. 2) Dial toll free: 1-800-638-8369 (or in Canada, 1-800-387-8330). When you see CONNECT on your screen, quickly type HHH. 3) At the U#= prompt, enter XTX99003,WRITERS and press Return. 4) Have a major credit card ready (or in the U.S., you can also use your checking account number). For voice information (in other words... a real person), call 800-638-9636. ************* <[Jack] WRITERS.INK> Okay folks tonight's guest is R. U. Sirius of the Mondo 2000 magazine and book. I'll start off with the first question... How did you come up with the name for the magazine? <[R. U. Sirius]> We had a publication called Reality Hackers that wasn't doing that well. We were moving in the direction of cyberpunk and those kinds of influences and wanted something that had more of an overall pop gestalt. I was watching tv severely wasted one night and there were all these ads for this and that "2000." and a whole show called Discovery 2000. I crawled into Queen Mu's bedroom and said "Everybody's using 2000 to sell shit. Why not us?" She immediately came up with MONDO 2000 cause she knew that all the 0's would make for a good looking logo. <[Barbara] B.PAUL> I keep reading cyberpunk is dead; is that why you want a more pop gestalt? <[R. U. Sirius]> Well, in a literal sense, cyberpunk was never really alive. It's all media mythology and as the culture complexities, less and less people want to conform to any sort of tribal identity for a long period of time. But basically we wanted to really be effective communicators and succeed at what we're doing. And part of doing that involves a bit of strategic thinking while at the same time working within whatever your obsessions and interests happen to be... It was always important to us that we published a very slick looking magazine. It's like dressing up to get inside an establishment dinner. It's much more subversive, I think, than picketing outside with your fist in the air. <[Barbara] B.PAUL> Actually, I like the nonexistent cyberpunk myself; the word has attached itself to a certain style and pov that are distinctive. Do you mean you've lost interest in it? <[R. U. Sirius]> I like the sort of tough post punk no bullshit aesthetic that was expressed through cyberpunk sci fi and the way that sort of took on a living breathing reality in hacker and in industrial performance culture. I just don't like to get caught up in movements or names like cyberpunk. The sense of the thing continues. I know very few people who actually want to call themselves "a Cyberpunk." you seem to have an idea in mind in publishing MONDO 200o, do you have a succinct philosophy? <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> HA!!!! The explanation for the meme changes every time I have to answer the question. I'll put it in two ways, one of them politic and the other one vulgar 1) MONDO is a magazine for the culture of cyberspace, for a generation that has grown up inside of media, inside of bits and bytes and who can recognize the fact that this is the primary territory in which our socio-political and economic lives are taking place. It's about consciously occupying that space. In fact, it's possible that a relatively democratic do-it-yourself "sub"culture has really moved into cyberspace more completely than the power elites. 2: MONDO 2000 is here to give the high tech culture of America in the 90's the enema it so desperately needs!!! <[Bryce] K.CAMPBELL14> What's your opinion on the media/corporations applying the 'cyber' label to everything (from Networks like GEnie to microprocessor controlled toasters). <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> It's good for MONDO and what's good for MONDO is good for Amerika! Seriously though it's just another bit of language manipulation that everybody 'll soon get sick of next everybody from GE to toasters will try to latch on to shamanism... like, Be all that you can be in the new shamanic army etcetera. <[Danny] D.PERLMAN> I have limited contact with the mag, having skimmed the book and read issue 8 in the last 48 hours (my mind is cyber goo) but, I found it fascinating. However, I noted right off the bat that the leadoff article on Information America had some stuff that didn't quite sit right fact-wise, and with about 90 seconds of computer time determined that, at least according to the databases of the two newspapers cited, the articles, used as bibliographic reference don't exist. What's the deal? Are your articles intended to be "factual", or more for amusement? <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> I believe that article was intended to be accurate although employing hardcore fact checkers is not in our budget yet. We've gotten a number of letters on that piece going both ways, challenging some of the details or adding additional paranoid data to the brew. We'd be interested in any specific details that you care to refute. <[John] J.BILICSKA> Do you foresee MONDO 2000 ever becoming a victim of its own success, a la ROLLING STONE (since mass culture absorbs every counterculture, eventually)? <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> If the magazine gets sold to somebody else, it might get wimp-ized. But as long as Mu and I are at it, it'll always be wierd. We can't help it. SUre, we might sell it some day and apply our wierdness to something else. <[John] J.BILICSKA> Are you contemplating a multimedia/interactive version of MONDO 2000? I think it would really blow the minds of suburbanites buying those CD-ROM drives. <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> Yeah, I'm talking with somebody right now about doing a cd rom version of the Guide. Also, might edit a cd rom version of Peter Stafford's Psychedelic's Encyclopedia, a return to my roots for me... hope CBS doesn't hear about it! <[CuD] GRMEYER> I've been enjoying the book and mag for quite some time now, thanks. I've wondered if you've ever run into any 'censorship' (at whatever level). <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> We've had problems with printers, I believe over female breasts, though the current printer, who we've been with for I think 5 issues, hasn't given us any problems. We've had some internal wrangles, which I won't go into... guess I'll have to write an autobiography some day. <[Jack] WRITERS.INK> Since magazines tend to be business and business means money, I was curious if you have control of the magazine or if you have investors who profer opinions and advice. Success doesn't always bring the best ... er help. <[R. U. Sirius] PRESS22> To be honest, Queen Mu is the majority owner and has complete control over the magazine. We do wrestle occasionally... ***end of conference excerpt*** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 93 23:59:48 CDT From: Ron Subject: File 6--Rune Stone BBS (IIRG Home Board) Back On-Line US BBS Callers: Rune Stone BBS (IIRG WHQ) 203-832-8441 NUP:Conspiracy Thanks once again: Mercenary/IIRG ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ THE INTERNATIONAL INFORMATION RETRIEVAL GUILD Invites The Readers of CUD To Call and Participate on The IIRG's Public Bulletin Board System, and WHQ : The Rune Stone BBS. Available at: (203)-832-8441 14.4 HST Public Node 1200-2400 Baud Callers Welcome Home of The IIRG Archives and Phantasy Magazine 3000+ Hack/Phreak Text and Magazines Archived by The IIRG. NO Ratios, and No Access Charges in the tradition of FREE information for all. Sysop: Mercenary Co-Sysop: Anubis New User Password: CONSPIRACY ------------------------------ End of Computer Underground Digest #5.28 ************************************


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